Tender Roots Introduction

[00:00:00] Speaker A: The first episode of the Tender Roots podcast. I'm excited because most people won't know that I met you through the panoramic experience, which is a project that a really good friend of mine, Robert H. Johnson, Jr. Is doing, which will be in a couple of weeks in Atlanta, which you're going to be speaking at, which I'm excited for that. And during our introduction, we did this thing where we introduced all the speakers, and I met Dr. Sai on our supposedly quick run through. And during that moment, she stopped me in my tracks. I was prepared to do my quick little hey, how you doing? Great, and get off the line. And she dropped this line where she said, trauma work is Dei work, and vice versa. Dei work is trauma work. And it really brought a lot of things home to me for why it has become so difficult to move the needle in regards to Dei. But more importantly, she had some insight into some psychological things that were going on in the space that I felt needed to have a voice. And so I coerced her to do a. So here we are on the Tender Roots podcast. Dr. Syed, great to have you on. [00:01:12] Speaker B: I am really happy to be here, and thank you for such a warm and flattering introduction. I'm really looking forward to talking with you and sharing you more about my experience and as a co founder of Tender Roots and talking about black mental health. [00:01:28] Speaker A: Awesome. I love. Before we dive into you, Dr. Sai, tell us a little bit about tender roots, the business and the name, how it came to be, so to speak. [00:01:39] Speaker B: Yeah, tender roots really started right before or just as the pandemic was hitting. And my colleague, Ellen Sweetman, had reached out to me as she was doing her own kind of process, kind of returning back to things that were fundamental to her and things that were important to her. And we had actually been college friends and college roommates. And so that was 30 years ago, and we had sort of lost track of each other over those 30 years. But she had been a dear friend, and we had done a lot of sort of social and political organizing together in college. And so she was in kind of a place in her life where she was reflecting and looking to reconnect to the things that were important to her over the course of her life. And so she reached out and reconnected and refound our friendship again. And there's lots to that part of the story, but part of that is as the pandemic was coming and a real shift in time was taking place, the pandemic. And then, of course, George Floyd, the murder of George Floyd that happened right here. I mean, ground zero. I am literally walking distance from the police station that was burned, set on fire. This was literally my neighborhood. And so all of that was coming together and converging. And one of the things or two of the things that we noticed in that the pandemic was people were necessarily we were required to retreat. We were required to shelter in place, so to speak. And for some of us, for many of us, that was creating loneliness and isolation. There were increases in domestic violence. There were all kinds of things going on as a result of that loneliness. And that sort of forced people rediscovering their families in ways that they had not been forced to deal with. And so that was taking place. And then just what was going on in the world just was so big as a result of George. Floyd and so people were responding to that in some of us in negative ways. And some of us were actually. I know this was going to sound strange, but there were the blessings of the pandemic, the slowing down of the world. And for some people, that was scary. And for some people, that was like refuge. For some of us, we were taking that time, the slowing down of the world, to really reflect and to really find some quiet and to really come back again to see and examine our lives in the world in ways that the speed of life had not allowed us to before. So with those two things going on, both the good or the favorable and the unfavorable, having all at once brought upon these conditions, we started thinking about how we wanted to give back to our community, how we wanted to address these feelings of loneliness and isolation, lack of community, people not having community, and that not having community. Having a profound impact on people's mental health and well being. But yet, at the same time, having an opportunity to really examine ourselves in ways that life had not allowed before. And it's from that place that tender roots was born. And these are tender roots is exactly what it is, exactly what it sounds like. All of that. Anytime you're embarking on a new journey, anytime you are planting a seed, letting that seed grow, and establishing those first roots. Now, over time, if you've ever pulled up a plant that you've had for a long time, those are some sturdy roots. I've been planting today, actually, and I've been looking at root systems, interestingly. And the older the roots are, the stronger they are. They can weather the storm, and they can be very difficult to tear or pull apart. But when a seed is just planting, when a seed is just planting those roots are so tender and so fragile that a strong wind or a heavy downpour, it can destroy it. So you have to be very gentle with those tender roots from a seed just being planted. And tender roots is that seed that allow that it creates a space for people to find community. More than anything, tender roots seeks to establish community for those of us who are fragile and need to be held with kid gloves for a while, that need to be protected from the storm. So until our roots get solid and strong and unable to be torn apart. And so that's the spirit of tender roots. We establish communities and opportunities to people to find well being. Now, how that relates, now we have different communities that we work with, different populations that we work with in order to establish those connections and to create well being. So that work looks a little bit different depending on who we are serving. So we serve individuals, we serve families and communities and organizations, right? So the work looks a little bit different depending on who we're serving. So you met me in the capacity of the work that tender roots is doing around diversity, equity and inclusion. That's how you know me. So those are our clients as businesses, organizations, for profit, nonprofit, governmental agencies. So any of those organizations that are looking to establish well being through the lens of diversity, equity, inclusion, that's what tender roots does, is that we help people navigate the emotional and psychological components of building diversity, equity, inclusion in their organizations. And so we also do those kinds of practical things. Like we do diversity training, sort of information about the components that are involved in diversity, equity, inclusion that people have to be sensitive to in order to do this work. Things like we help people understand things like intersectionality or internalized racism, definitions of white supremacy. We do all of that kind of sensitivity, awareness, and kinds of training. And those are important components of DEI work, but they don't actually produce equity. I mean, people can get all the information that they want. They can know, but just having information doesn't necessarily change behavior. Having information doesn't necessarily change behavior. And so we help people, so we do those trainings and they're important pieces of the puzzle. But no, you're not going to get to equity through that, because equity involves a change of behavior that allows for a change in structures and systems. And just having information alone doesn't allow you to do that, although it's important, it's an important piece of the puzzle. So we do the kinds of things that allow people to establish communities where people care. And when you care, when you have a certain level of investment, it's that investment, that care, that connection to people, your coworkers, the people in your organization, that allows you to then want to think about changing your behavior. And if you change your behavior in order to build community and connection, then you start to do things like change structures, you change policy. And it's those policies of recruitment and retention that is the heart of equity, recruitment and retention, those kinds of policies that allow for that and create space to have the diversity and then the policies that support people once they're in place, that's what we do, is that we help people get to equity through community. Yeah. And that's tender roots. That's the lens that you know me through. But then we have these other pieces of the puzzle where we work with individuals, and we work with families as well, around their journey to find well being and to build connections on an individual level, and then on that family and community level as well. That's the heart. That is the heart of tenderbroots, is to help people find well being. [00:11:09] Speaker A: Love that. That's beautiful. Now, when you say, I know the DEI aspect of it, when we go back to individuals and families, what would that look like? If a family needed to get counseling from you, how would they go about that? What would be the easiest way? [00:11:25] Speaker B: Yeah, what would be the easiest way? So that's really interesting. So, first of all, everything always starts with a kind of assessment. And so there are divisions, right, in people's families. And I am particularly looking at the kinds of divisions that happen as a result of being in the african american community. So all my clients are not african american. I serve a very diverse community here in Minneapolis. So a portion of my clients, of course, are african american, but I'm serving people who have asian backgrounds and latino backgrounds and all kinds of folks, recent immigrants, newly immigrant, and all of the differences and all the diversity pieces. But recently, a lot of the work that I'm doing around family is around healing the issues, working with people to heal the issues that happen, that are unique to the african american experience. And so we assess people, and people are really struggling with the kinds of divisions and things that tear us apart. Some of that is through the lens of incarceration, fatherlessness, violence. That is particularly the kinds of type of violence is part of every community, but kinds of violence that are specific to the african american community and the african american experience, those kinds of divisions, those kinds of separations. I mean, if you think about family as a kind of community, the divisions that really have their historical origins in white supremacy and colonialism and coming out of our many narratives. Our many narratives. But one narrative is the slave narrative, that there are some things, divisions between african american men and women and in the family, the things that have torn us apart, that are part of our historical structures in the systematic and intentional delusion, disenfranchisement of the black family. Those are the kinds of things that now we don't always understand the origins of how the black family has come to be and the struggles that we have. But those things all are a part of our history in slave culture and white supremacy culture. So we are looking particularly at those things and how to realign and bring families together when they're torn apart by those historical factors that come to play out over time. [00:14:15] Speaker A: Wow, that's deep. I'm intrigued by that work, not only because I lost my father a couple of years ago, but during the moment when I lost my father, it opened me up to my tender roots. And I think that during those moments, I was able to access so many more emotions that I had suppressed for so long. But I wasn't prepared for them. Right. I wasn't prepared for all that information. But I think the one thing that really took me by surprise was that my community was being decimated. I had found a way to rise above what had been expected of me, but even that kept me limited to what I was supposed to be. And it was heartbreaking, because I have family members that I know are just as smart or just as intelligent or just as sharp as I am that aren't doing anything with their lives, and not necessarily because they didn't want to, but because the environment in which that they found themselves didn't give them the content necessary where they could build a house. That could mean, I love your work. And this goes into the conversation we were having a couple of weeks back about they cloned Tyrone. But, man, I love that work. And we have to do a segment on black male mental health, because I think that right now is really heavy. But before we go down that they clone Tyrone, Dr. Sai, tell us a little bit about who you are, the person, how you get into this. And I love your background. I know that you said your father actually worked with the NAACP, is that correct? [00:15:53] Speaker B: For almost my whole life. That he just retired probably within the last ten years. He's 79 years old. I think he probably tired in his late 60s, early 70s, but he had been the president of the NAACP in Duluth, Minnesota, where I'm from, which is the teeny itty bitty. It's not itty bitty, but it's a small town on the tip of Lake Superior. You can find it on a map. It is on the map. It has about 100,000 people. It's in northern Minnesota. It's a white community. But my father largely. But there was a very small but really significant african american community in Duluth, Minnesota, where I grew up. And my father was the president of the NAACP in Duluth, and then he was also the president of the three state conference, which is North Dakota, South Dakota, and Minnesota. And I actually think Iowa is included in that, too. So I grew up very much involved in his social justice work through the NAACP, and very informative, informs who I am and how I think about the world. [00:17:07] Speaker A: I know. I love the part where you were mentioning that you would be out on the trail, walking the communities, going door to door. I think that kind of childhood just prepares you for the war that we all end up having to face, whether we recognize it or beautiful. I want to dive into the conversation about black mental health. I know you and I spoke the last couple of times about mental health in the black community, and I was in a rage about they cloned Tyrone. Because I just had seen it. And having experienced a mental break myself in the last couple of years, it's made me look at it through a different lens and not the stereotypical lens that I grew up seeing it through. And one of the things that I find is the media has taken front row seat to the show, and they are leading the charge. And when I saw the movie, they cloned Tyrone, all I could think of was mental health, right? I mean, starting from there are no positive black men in this entire show. That's not one. Right. There are no positive black man to man relationships. Right? There aren't any positive black female to male relationships. I mean, in essence, our entire relationships in this movie emulate the darkest communities that we have in America today. And I took that as a stance from Hollywood to, one, make it acceptable because it was a comedy, right? But then to make it entertaining. And I took it personal, because to me, it is personal. They were breaking up the hair products that the black women put in their hair to make their hair straight. My mom did that for 2030 years, not knowing that stuff was toxic, right. That it was poisoning her. And so the movie just, it summed up what I feel that black men have always had to do. We've had to hug our enemy as our family. Right? I mean, Jamie Foxx is an amazing. Know all these top actors are amazing actors. And I think a lot of times we lose sight that when children, teenagers, heck, and even adults, when they look at the movie and they're entertained, they're not really realizing that that entertainment is allowing that data and that information to set seed into that side their subconscious and they're accepting this data and they're using it and they're becoming it. Right. And the cloning of Tyrone has been happening. Right. It's a past tense story in my opinion. I think that they just had the nerve to make it a show. Right. And even watching the show, it's cloning Tyrone. Right. If a ten year old young boy sees his favorite character who was once Ray Charles is now a pimp. Right. The lines are hard for children to understand sometimes. I just wanted to get your opinion because I know you watched a little bit of it because you couldn't stomach the whole show. [00:20:15] Speaker B: I couldn't get through. I probably watched the first 30 minutes and then I just said, oh, I think I'm done. And the comedy part, I couldn't get to the, I mean, I don't even know what about that in the first 30 minutes. I don't know what about what that was comedy. I know, I was looking for it. I was like, okay, I'm going to watch a slow comedy. I might be offended, but I'll chuckle. No, I was just offended. And it just had every stereotype of black men and women that you could possibly imagine. Every old story, every old narrative, every sense of black exploitation was just in those 1st 30 minutes. And I couldn't stomach it. I couldn't tolerate it. I just cannot be fed that diet anymore. And so I didn't get past 30 minutes. So I'm just going to say that. And here is what I am thinking about the stereotype. Okay? So stereotypes happen because there's a little nugget of truth in it, right? But it's not the whole story. So I could recognize some of the people that I know in those stereotypes. I could see how those stereotypes play out every day. And as a matter of fact, I watched that having just had a conversation with a friend who lost both a brother and a cousin in the same week to gang violence. They were both murdered the week before I watched this, right. And so it could have went down the very way that the movie displayed how that I'm shooting, right? So these things happen. There's violence, there is gang violence. But here's the thing about what you feed yourself, like, is there anything redeeming about this movie? So I say that there are stereotypes. Some of it are nuggets of truth. People will recognize and see themselves in those stereotypes, and we'll chuck about it and we'll laugh and we'll say, I know that that sounds familiar, right? And we'll be entertained by it because it's a lie and it's the truth at the same time. Right? It's a lie and a truth at the same time, because that is not the whole african american experience. That is not the whole black experience. That is a stereotype. Highly stereotyped. That's the point. It's a highly stereotyped fabrication of what it means to be black during this time period. And when you feed that, when you feed that, if it's junk, because it's not really truth, it's junk. And so is there anything redeeming? Why would anybody want to see this? So if we're having a steady diet of junk, if we're feeding ourselves when we so desperately need hope and love and connection and positive role models and ways to turn how to find ourselves out of those stereotypes, we need those images, right? We need the truth. But that truth also has to be counterbalanced with all of the components of what is true for us. And so that movie was just limited. It was like speeding on a diet of junk food. There was no nourishment in there, at least certainly not in the first 30 minutes. I don't know if it ever redeems itself, but it's junk food. It's junk food, and it's not going to nourish you. It's not going to grow your mind. It's not going to offer you a pathway out. It is just junk food. And therefore, it, to me, has no redeeming qualities. [00:23:42] Speaker A: I like that. It was definitely junk food. I think I stuck with it because I was intrigued by where it was going. And I think I'm at that age where this is fresh for me. This is new for me. I feel like I'm an intelligent individual, but a lot of times we can get trapped inside a corporate mindset and not see the world for what it is trying to get to a place. And I think a lot of black men, a lot of men in general, sometimes when you put your head down and you go to work to try to build something, you can get caught in that grind to where you don't really see what's going on around you. And I really wanted to experience what the intent was. I was hoping that at the end there was some kind of parade or there was some kind of sermon in church. You go through Sunday school. Then the choir sings. Then there's an offering, then there's a sermon. Right. And to me, the gift of Sunday service was at the end. The pastor was going to redeem whoever. If the choir didn't do a good job. If the sermon didn't do a good job, he was going to bring it home with his words. And I was hoping that they were going to do that. And they doubled down. Right. They doubled down on it. And I think there's a lot of conversation about it now. And I think that, just like you said, it's junk food and there are no redeeming qualities. I think it completely annihilated any idea that black people can be anything other than what that show made it out to be. Right. I mean, no one was smarter at the end. Yeah. They realized that we being controlled by the white man, and even to that degree, that is dangerous. Right. I think that a lot of times we get lost that the white man has his thumb on our heads. And while there is definitely white supremacy, if we continue to look at life through that lens only we'll never realize that. We've always had the know. And it's sad for me to even think like this, but we don't have any Martin Luther King's and Malcolm X's anymore. We don't have those guys, and we don't have them for a strategic reason. They have eradicated that kind of idea, and they've made the people who could even be them so afraid that they would never try that route. [00:25:58] Speaker B: Exactly. Because we saw what happened to those men, those leaders in the community. They become targets, and they're oft 100%. The strength and the weakness of the Black Lives Matter movement is that there's no centralized figure to rally behind. And that is an issue. It's an issue. There is no one thing that galvanizes us and brings it together, but that's also. It was intentional to not have a centralized leader, and then it's a strength and it's a detriment. It's a safety issue. [00:26:41] Speaker A: I never thought about that, not having a centralized, because then you don't have an epicenter, so to speak, to come back to and regroup and reassess. Did we lose? Did we win? But if there is no head, then there's no discussion. It's just. I got to write that down. [00:26:59] Speaker B: Yeah. It's intentional and it's organized actions, but there's no one centralized figure that is leading that movement. And that is my understanding of it. Someone can correct me, if I'm wrong, that is intentional, and it's a safety issue. But then it's also the people that were able to pull. I mean, I've been to Black Lives Matter meetings, and there's a sense of, what are we doing? We know what we're doing on the grander scheme of things, but there's no one person to kind of pull us together on a common vision or common goal in the moment of those gatherings and rallies. And so in the George Floyd kind of era, as we were seeing lots of movement from the Black Lives Matter Minnesota, and Black Lives Matter St. Paul and Minneapolis, is that we were seeing flash mops happening, thousands of people coming together. Something would go up, and we would be responding to some event that happened in the community. You could put something on social media, and within a matter of hours, you could have thousands of people gathering to address whatever it was that happened largely during that time. It was police violence or police. Another unarmed black man was hurt or killed in some way. And people could galvanize like that. And yet when we convened, there was this sense of what's bringing us together. All these people came together to tackle this and speak out against the injustice. But there was something that wasn't connecting each one of us in that moment. Like a leader would, like a Malcolm X would, like a Dr. King would. There just wasn't that thing to pull us together. And so it felt dispersed, even though thousands of people had convened. And I missed that. I missed. [00:29:10] Speaker A: Sad. And I'll recognize that feeling of sadness when I think about what we used to have. Even when you watch as many Martin Luther King movies as out there, you can watch all of them. Same with Malcolm X. The one thing that resonates is at the end of their lives, those men seemed so hurt and miserable because they had really came to the point to where they realized that this is working against us stronger than they ever could have imagined. And I think that that era was a time for the forces that be to recognize the strengths in black people's unity and try to make it to where it could never happen again. And they succeeded to some degree, yeah. [00:29:58] Speaker B: But things do change, and things do evolve, and those changes and evolve at the same time. We can't lose the lessons of the past. During this time, they rereleased the autobiography of Malcolm X. And I read chapter. I want to say I didn't read the whole thing, but I want to say I think it was chapter 13. And when I read this particular chapter of Malcolm X's autobiography, it was like he was speaking at the moment. It was like nothing had changed. He could have been talking in 2021. He could have been talking modern day. Nothing has changed. He was talking about the same thing, the violence, the police corruption, all of it, like it was happening now. It was on point. It was current. And many of the lessons learned, many of the lessons learned about how to do human rights, social justice, and act up and rise up against racism and white supremacy, it's in there. And so some of the mistakes that we are making now, if we would go back and remember our history and to read the things that we need to read to understand that the struggle has not changed, and the things that were relevant and valid 30 and 40 years ago are still relevant and valid. And so one of the things I'm missing, and one of the things that I am longing for, particularly out of things of the current attempts to organize, is the intergenerational connection. I really appreciate what younger people are doing. And I'm kind of in the middle. I'm kind of in the middle. I'm not a baby boomer. I'm a Gen Xer. And then there are millennials and Gen Z people. And this experience of creating change needs to be intergenerational, because we are losing the lessons learned in the past about how to organize. And yet some of these things, the newer things, this ability to use social media as a call to action, and some of the things that younger people have a kind of currency and fluency in learning how to use these tools for organizing. Imagine if we were intergenerational and we were all working together to remember the lessons of the past, using the current outlooks and resources and using social media, if we pulled that together, about how powerful it could be. But I am finding, and other people may have a different experience. My experience is not one that is intergenerational. And therefore, we are missing opportunity in our current efforts at organizing against racism and white supremacy culture. [00:32:54] Speaker A: I like that. Intergenerational fluency. I think that goes along the lines of passing the baton from son to father to grandfather, and that information being passed down to each of them, neither one being more important than the next, but each one being just as important to the whole. And I think that's beautiful. Intergenerational. Now, before we close, I love spending time with you because you always give me hope, even when I'm sad about something. What advice could you give for us that are out here right now, in the middle of the situation we're in, to do what we can, where we are, I think a lot of times, there's a lot of shows, there's a lot of movies and podcasts out there that always tell the story of the burning house. But sometimes we should give hope where we can. What would you give to us as something that we can do where we are right now to help us get along until we can get our hands on this thing? [00:34:03] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. Is to take care of yourself, is to take care of the community. Sometimes people think that taking care of yourself is a selfish thing. We hear these things about self care, and self care has to happen in combination with our collective care. But doing that starts with our individual wellness. Focus on your individual wellness. You be well, and when you are well, you shine. You shine that light on other people, and you're out of the shadows, and people will see and be attracted to your wellness and well being. Focus on your own well being. And from that, expand. When you are well, then you are in a place to help build the community. Then you're in a place to be an example and a role model for another person. And so I have something called the five pillars, and it's very simple. It is the foundation of mental health, and it's supported by evidence based research. And they're the five pillars. I'm going to tell you what the five pillars are. To establish the platform, the beginning of your own mental health and wellness. It starts with these things, and they are so simple and yet hard to attain. Okay, here's the five pillars. Protect your sleep. Get the recommended amount of sleep for you. Typically, that should not be less than 6 hours. There's a range anywhere, depending on your age too, as well. But for most adults, that's somewhere between six and 8 hours a night. Don't compromise your sleep. There's an epidemic problem with sleep right now for many reasons, but protect your sleep. Figure it out. That is so important. Drink water. Drink your recommended amounts of water. It's a little bit changing now. We've always heard eight to ten glasses of water a day. But you can also get that water through the foods that you eat. But hydrate, hydrate your body. The next one is eat well. Eat primarily a plant based diet. I'm not saying become vegetarian. I didn't say that. That's actually not. The folks who live the longest are not vegetarians. They're people who have a primarily plant based diet with some forms of animal protein. Those are actually the best diets where people live the longest. It is not to be vegan. Then move your body. Move your body every single day. This does not necessarily mean going to the gym. You don't need a gym membership to move your body, to be healthy and to be fit. You can just park further away from the door. Add activity and movement. Garden, walk up, take the stairs instead of the elevator, get more activity and movement in your day. Don't sit for more than 15 minutes at a time, stand up. Not for more than 15 to 30 minutes at a time, stand up. Just walk yourself to get. Don't sit down at your computer and just plant yourself there and stay there for hours at a time. Get up and move your body every 15 to 30 minutes. It doesn't have to be a full workout routine. Don't be sitting. And then the last pillar is do not isolate. Make sure that you have connections to community. Make sure that you have friends and family, a faith community. Do not isolate yourself. That we are a gregarious people and we are meant to be in the company of others, that we understand each ourselves through our relationships. And the happiest people are the people that stay well connected. And that is also researched and evidence based. [00:38:00] Speaker A: I lost you there for a little bit, so I missed one. I'm going to start from the top. Protect your sleep, which I learned that late in life, but I definitely do that. Drink water, move your body and do not isolate. I missed the fourth one, eat well. [00:38:19] Speaker B: Primarily plant based diet. Did you get that? [00:38:24] Speaker A: That's how you can tell that this has been a good podcast. The Internet is working against us. I know it's a good podcast. [00:38:30] Speaker B: Eat well, eat well, a primarily plant based diet, not necessarily a vegan or even a vegetarian diet, but primarily plant based with some animal proteins. I agree, well, eat well, stay away from the junk food. [00:38:48] Speaker A: I agree. One thing that I'm learning because my fiance, she doesn't always necessarily didn't eat fruits like I would like to. And I mentioned to her, I said, you are a water being. If whatever you're eating is not 50% water, then it's working against you. [00:39:07] Speaker B: Right? [00:39:07] Speaker A: And so that's how I try to keep it simple. [00:39:13] Speaker B: Yeah, those are the five pillars. Start there, start there, be well, protect those five things as the foundation for your own mental health and well being. Start there. And then it can get more nuanced and more complex as you go. Your mental health issues, if you're actually diagnosable right now, the most common forms of mental health issues and crises really come in the form of anxiety and depression. Those are the most prolific in our community and in the United States. Is anxiety and depression. And so if you're diagnosable, don't be. Yeah, don't be ashamed. Get away from the stigma of seeking out mental health support. If you feel like your issues are now starting to affect the quality of your life and your relationships, it is time to seek the help of some mental health professional to support you in your well being. And don't fall prey to the stigma. Go on it and get some support. [00:40:31] Speaker A: I agree. I think that's amazing. Thank you, doctor, for your time. This was amazing and it was a great first kickoff for the podcast. Do you think that we'll be able to do another one in next two weeks? [00:40:48] Speaker B: Oh, I would love to. I would love to. I think that that is very possible. I would love to. [00:40:53] Speaker A: And we should definitely introduce the other half of Tinder roots so that we can all meet the full family. But I'm excited. I'm hoping to kind of get out there and visit you guys in the next 30 to 60 days and we'll set that up when it makes sense and then we can do something on site. But I definitely am excited about podcast and getting to grow this adventure. [00:41:19] Speaker B: Yeah, I'm looking forward to it as well. It's a great connection and I'm so glad that I was able to make this connection. [00:41:29] Speaker A: Awesome. What I'm going to do, I'm going to hit the stop button on the recording portion of it and.